avidactor,

I have not ignored anything that you've said. However, you put what I say into a very limited box.

Also, don't blame Jesus for what man has done. Yes, man has used Christianity to do and justify evil. Keep in mind that man did that, the Lord Jesus Christ did not do that.

There are a lot of people like George W. Bush, Pat Robertson, (the late) Jerry Falwell, etc., that claim to be Christians but I don't think that they really know the LORD at all.

I think that it would benefit you to look at Jesus and not look at the evils that man has done in the Name of Jesus and Christianity.

First, I'll openly admit that I'm not actually "reading" this thread. I don't feel called to battle or debate in here, so I'm mostly just reading snuka's posts. That being said . . .

quote:

Originally posted by snuka:
There are a lot of people like George W. Bush, Pat Robertson, (the late) Jerry Falwell, etc., that claim to be Christians but I don't think that they really know the LORD at all.

I think that it would benefit you to look at Jesus and not look at the evils that man has done in the Name of Jesus and Christianity.

There is so much truth in those sentences. People often talk about what Christians say, do, or believe, and then begin to cite people like Jerry Falwell and George W. Bush as the examples. Neither of those two come anywhere close to being standard bearers of Christianity. In all honest, I generally tend to see Jesus best manifested by his most liberal followers, not the conservatives. The Pharisees were the Conservatives of Jesus' day, and they called for His death.

At the end of the day, I realize that Christians shoulder the blame for allowing the Falwells of the world to get away with misrepresenting our beautiful faith. Fortunately, there are more and more non-conservatives who are moving to the forefront and being recognized as Christian leaders, as well. Pastor Greg Boyd out of Minnesota is one of my favorites. Jim Wallis (out of Massachusetts, I believe) is another. These are people who know that Christianity has nothing to do with Republicanism, Capitalism, Patriotism, or "Americanism." Hopefully, the world will start to see Christianity as much more than what the Pat Robertsons of the world have gotten away with misrepresenting it as.

Snuka
Just because there are trees, birds & animals
& you do not know how to explain how it got here, does not mean it was a "GOD"

quote:

Originally posted by emmyaward4:
Snuka
Just because there are trees, birds & animals
& you do not know how to explain how it got here, does not mean it was a "GOD"

Emmy, I dont know if you're responding to me or to snuka. I have faith in a higher spirit, and I can't explain how the universe was formed. I clearly am not wise enough to say how it all began. I can only believe my thoughts. I will never press anyone to believe what I do. If you believe in creationism, the big bang, jesus, buddah, etc then by all means, embrace your ideas! I hope you weren't getting us mixed up!

i said Snuka when i wrote tha.t
& by all means i am not mixing you up.
I agree with you!!! through all this.
I HAPPEN not to believe at all
But i am a minority(I know that)
I just do not agree with alot of what he says.
Believe it or not I am a godmother
ALL my friends are christain or catholic, i have been to church many times
I am just sick of it being shoved down my throat & being told shit like it's the only way & you are going to hell. it's so ridiculous & Wrong

emmyaward4,

Instead of just ignoring my posts, you keep responding to them. Why is that? Perhaps, deep down you feel that I'm speaking the Truth and you're trying to reject and battle with that Truth.

-----------------------

avidactor,

You can't blame Jesus for what people like Pat Robertson say and do. I wouldn't blame you for what your friends, family, associates, etc., may do.

You are good at twisting what I say and twisting the Truth and purpose of the Lord Jesus Christ.

It is all about the Lord Jesus Christ. It is not even about the Christian religion. It's about Jesus!

no dear
i respond because i have a right to state my point of view, your posts do not belong here, if i ignore that , i am acting like it does

quote:

Originally posted by snuka:

avidactor,

You can't blame Jesus for what people like Pat Robertson say and do. I wouldn't blame you for what your friends, family, associates, etc., may do.

My friends' actions aren't in the name of Nick Scott. That's the difference.

You are good at twisting what I say and twisting the Truth and purpose of the Lord Jesus Christ.

No, I've done no twisting whatsoever. In fact, I even admitted (several times) that I have no answer as to what the Great Spirit is. I am humble enough as a creature on this earth to KNOW that I DONT KNOW. Lets say for shits and giggles that ok, Jesus is God, who are YOU to say what his "purpose" is? Who are ANY OF US to say what our creator's purpose is?? Again, snuka, for the umpteenth you've made yourself look stupid.

It is all about the Lord Jesus Christ. It is not even about the Christian religion. It's about Jesus!

Wow, reality has passed you by and didn't even blow you a kiss. Little question here, isn't christianity ALL about Jesus?? So, to say its about Jesus, its about Christianity. Honestly, dude, you should just stop posting indefinitely. You're only digging yourself deeper into a hole of ignorance. Let me ask you something. Is there only ONE method to acting?

I know you can see where I'm getting with this. If you think there is only one method to doing ANYTHING, then your life is stagnant, immoble, and predictable. If thats how you want to live, then so be it. But this is an acting site my friend. We as actors live and breathe the lives of many when we work. We must be ever changing, and always open to the real world around us. If we live in a bubble, the world will never grow from that bubble. Im sure thats how you want us all to live. You want us all to be a community of God Fearing men who use prayer to get us out of our "sins", and who look to the "word" (what word, exactly is that?) of the Lord for answers. Um, I don't know a word that can get me out of debt. I know a job though! I don't know a word that can heal my sick family members, but I know a doctor though! The WORD of the lord, as it seems to me is:
Manipulation
Lets manipulate terms and phrases to fit our current agenda (This is something even YOU don't deny. You even said it yourself in an earlier post!)
Lets manipulate ideas to make profit (the greatest theme of the church!)
Let's manipulate thought! (So we can control the masses into a life of war, poverty, slavery, and starvation)

The word of the Lord Jesus Christ:
manipulation

I could just see pee-wee herman and Cherry and the rest of the playhouse screaming their heads off now!

I haven’t heard so much Scripture spoken since I read the Old & New Testament.

Quoting the Good Book chapter-and-verse is certainly one way to illustrate a point, but it takes us further away from the central topic, at least the one I raised with my original reply – that there are huge differences between simple religious discussions and PREACHING (often referred to by the faithful as, “sharing the Good Word”). “Discussion” connotes a two-way conversation, and “preaching” is always a one-way proposition, usually given from a pulpit. As I mentioned, I myself am a Christian, but I find many problems with how Christians often blur the line between religious freedom and overt religious fanaticism. I understand the pro’s and con’s of Christian doctrine quite well. My Uncle Kei was a doctorate in theology and was the pastor of his own church in the 40’s and 50’s, The Korean Methodist Church of Los Angeles. As committed as he was, I never saw him pushing his beliefs down anyone’s throat (perhaps one reason why he was so popular). Although this thread seems to be decidedly against religious pontificating, I believe “snuka” may be confusing, “hating Christians” with hating the way some Christians behave -- pushing their personal agendas without due consideration to how other groups may take offense, as many of the members of this board certainly have.

This debate could easily go on until Jesus returns, so I won’t comment on the “RIGHTNESS OR WRONGNESS” of anyone’s statements, but in my view the current controversy lies at the very core of Christian doctrine. In their religious zeal, many Christians believe that it is a FOREGONE CONCLUSION that Jesus is the true Messiah, that their religion is the only God-sanctioned faith on earth, that the Bible the only book containing the bona fide word of God (and that all others are either flawed or false), and that all who don’t agree are bound for Perdition. I do not subscribe to the Hell and Brimstone argument and I’m certainly not a Biblical scholar, I’m just a photographer. But I do know that there is a right and wrong way to make a point, and assuming that everyone believes as you do is the single biggest mistake of all. In any serious debate, this kind of viewpoint would be immediately dismissed as the rantings of a lunatic, yet many Christians routinely disregard this universal fact, their desire to proselytize (“saving souls”) seemingly overriding their otherwise good judgment. For groups like The Jehovah’s Witnesses, it is in fact the backbone of their entire religion, which they pursue with missionary vigor. If the concept of "separation of church and state" continues to have any revelance, the sanctity and diversity of all other belief systems must be respected. I'm certain that the Buddhists of Tibet share the same love of compassion as their Christian brothers, yet it is actually against their beliefs to openly promote their religion. Those who practice the ancient rites of Wicca (or "witchcraft") have the same depth of belief as any Baptist minister, yet their practices remain an intensely personal and private affair. Much can be learned from them (incidentally, they DO NOT worship Satan, nor even believe in the existence of a supreme being of evil).

I shudder to think how many sins have been committed “in the name of the Lord.” You can see the result of this kind of close-mindedness in the bizarre cults that you see on television everyday. This kind of rigid theology was largely responsible for the reign of the Spanish Inquisition, when failure to adhere to their doctrine lead to a litany of horrors and atrocities never before equaled in human history. I know from direct experience how blind, unquestioning adherence to any single mindset or belief is not only problematic, but often dangerous. Instead of building bridges of understanding, this kind of thinking often only creates more division and hatred. I often wonder if Jesus were alive today what he would think of the methodology of some of his followers.


What many Christian brothers and sisters don’t realize is that nothing makes you look more inferior than professing the “superior” premise that your belief in God is “right,” making all other religions by extension, “wrong.” As “avidactor” alluded to, whether the discussion is about Jesus of Nazareth or Lee Strasberg of The Method, whenever you begin speaking in absolutes, your potential converts begin scattering like scared rabbits. The originator of this thread offered: “I encourage anyone else to post discussions about Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Atheism or any other point of view. People shouldn't be afraid of discussing these topics.” True enough. But have you noticed all of the hundreds of charismatic Christian evangelists hard-selling their religion on dozens of syndicated TV programs from dawn to dusk, and how even the selection of a U. S. president can be decided on “how good of a Christian they are”? Clearly, the Christian Right’s influence in America is so influential and powerful that to even question it in public could lead to political censure, or worse. Suffice it to say, any Islamic quotations on this board would no doubt be viewed in a very suspicious light under George Bush’s authority. You can blame "The Patriot Act” for that.

Am I demanding that that preaching religion belongs only in church? No. The First Amendment guarantees the freedom to speak the truth as you know it -- anytime, anywhere, and I’ll fight to protect everyone’s right to speak freely and openly. But with freedom comes responsibility. Instead of actually “bringing converts to the Lord,” many a hardcore Christian succeeds only at alienating the very people they’re trying to “save.” To my way of thinking, the best way to win converts is BY EXAMPLE, not by sermonizing on the Internet or demonstrating the rigidity of your ideas. Call it “pearls before swine,” I just don’t think that an actors’ message board is the most productive forum for disseminating religious dogma of any kind.

Being forced to drink religious Kool-Aid, regardless the flavor, is never pleasant.

Whatever works.”

www.robertkim.com

Snuka, It's really sad that people think it's okay to talk about absolutely anything on this site except spirituality. In fact, it's a bit appalling to think that sex, hatred, abuse, vindictiveness and some of the other things that occasionally appear on this site are ok, but not what one believes. Bravo, snuka. Personally, I can't imagine being an actor without accepting some divine intervention...it's too tough a business to do on your own. If people are so uncomfortable with discussions of religion,they don't need to read these posts. This IS the 'Off Topic' column, isn't it? Keep meditating and expressing yourself, Snuka.

quote:

Originally posted by zdirector:
If people are so uncomfortable with discussions of religion,they don't need to read these posts. This IS the 'Off Topic' column, isn't it? Keep meditating and expressing yourself, Snuka.

For an explanation of terms, I think this is a good time to to quote the Webster's Unabridged Dictionary instead of the Holy Bible.

Here is the definition of, "MEDITATING."
Meditate: "To dwell on anything in thought; to contemplate."

Here is the definition of, "PREACHING."
Preach: "To declare in public; to deliver a sermon."

The differences and implications of meaning are immense. If you'd care to dispute the point, I'd bring it up with Mr. Webster.

Without a clear definition of terms, we cannot even hope of reaching a logical conclusion to this topic, much less communicate.

Awhile back, there was a powerful indie starring Edward James Olmos called, "The Legend of Gregorio Cortez," where the simple misinterpretation of a single word set in motion one of the bloodiest confrontations in early Mexican/American history. I wonder how many wars have been won and lost over such a minor but important thing...

Robert, you are the voice of reason once again. Your posts here have been the most logical, well-minded, and to me, most influential. Oh my God, you must be a witch!! Stone him!! stone him!! hehehe.
In all honesty, I know I have my feelings towards organized religion, whether it be christianty, judiaism, islam, etc. but, like you said, I would never press my beleifs on anyone. For one to say that we MUST believe THIS WAY just proves true lunacy.
And, your response to Z was priceless.
"whatever works" my friend! keep it up, because its good to see its workin' for you!

I heard the most wonderful explanation of the difference between a "spirtual" person and a "religious" person.

It goes like this: "A religious person preaches about Hell. A spiritual person has already been there and back."

www.robertkim.com

quote:

Originally posted by zdirector:
Snuka, It's really sad that people think it's okay to talk about absolutely anything on this site except spirituality. In fact, it's a bit appalling to think that sex, hatred, abuse, vindictiveness and some of the other things that occasionally appear on this site are ok, but not what one believes. Bravo, snuka. Personally, I can't imagine being an actor without accepting some divine intervention...it's too tough a business to do on your own. If people are so uncomfortable with discussions of religion,they don't need to read these posts. This IS the 'Off Topic' column, isn't it? Keep meditating and expressing yourself, Snuka.

I completely agree with you, Zdirector. I don't have a problem with people disagreeing with what Snuka writes. It's just that suggestion that he shouldn't even be allowed to post it. I found the anti-immigrant sentiment in the thread Donald started just as disturbing as anyone could've possibly found this one. But, I realize this is the off topic section. So, rather than suggesting Donald shouldn't post, I simply decided not to read it. Others may choose to read it and debate with Donald. But, I don't think anyone told Donald that it didn't belong here.

Part of me thinks there shouldn't even be an "off topic" section, and that everything on this board should relate to acting. In that case, there would be no religion, politics, or anything else that's likely to cause an uproar--aside from arguments over acting technique. But, then again, aren't the off-topic items just as relevant to acting as "technique?" I'm assuming that's why the moderator included this section. It's worth knowing what's going on in politics and current events, because you never know when you'll get an audition that relates to those things.

But by that logic, a discussion of religion could be just as relevant. What if one of you gets called in to play a Christian in a film? Are you going to play the character as self-righteous, hypocritical, war-mongering, right-winged, or any of the other myths and stereotypes that you have in mind when it comes to Christians? Would it not be worth knowing what a non-stereotyped Christian (since I don't think Snuka has played into any of those) believes and sounds like?

And that doesn't just apply to Christianity. Again, all of the Muslims, Jews, Hindus, and even Atheists should also feel free to write about whatever they believe in, or don't believe in. I could understand the anger if someone was trying to dictate that Christianity alone should be discussed here. But there is freedom to discuss any and all spirituality here. I'd argue for more discussion, not less. And those who choose not to discuss their beliefs shouldn't be on a mission to prevent others from discussing theirs. Otherwise, there's no point in having an off topic section, and we should talk about nothing more than classes, headshots, and filming.

quote:

Posted April 27, 2008 09:47 AM Hide Post
Snuka, It's really sad that people think it's okay to talk about absolutely anything on this site except spirituality. In fact, it's a bit appalling to think that sex, hatred, abuse, vindictiveness and some of the other things that occasionally appear on this site are ok, but not " these posts. This IS the 'Off Topic' column, isn't it? Keep meditating and expressing yourself, Snuka.

Posts: 9 | Location: USA | Registered: April 08, 2008 Reply With Quote

he can post if he wants
but expect to be replied to,
he is preaching the way he believes, that is different from just posting anything,
He is using this forum to teach the word of god, it's totally inappropriate
his way is the ONLY way
that is different from saying
"HEY let's talk about religion"
he posts like that once a week, sorry that's not
the same, so don't twist it around.
I went to my friends christain band last night
I Decided to be there for her, There religion was talked about (Obviously) That was the proper place

quote:

Originally posted by activated:
And that doesn't just apply to Christianity. Again, all of the Muslims, Jews, Hindus, and even Atheists should also feel free to write about whatever they believe in, or don't believe in.

Often, what conservative Christians SAY differs radically from what they DO.

Case-in-point: If Barack Obama professed being a Muslim instead of a card-carrying Christian, I wonder just how "open-minded and religiously tolerant" the "red states" would be? Answer: He'd sooner be welcomed as a member of the Ku Klux Klan.

I appears that my Christian brothers and sisters are so mired in their narrow interpretation of Jesus' teachings that they fail to realize or acknowledge the importance of all the world's great religions and faiths. This attitude is not only evident on this thread, but in any religion that espouses a slavish devotion to unquestioning, blind faith.

It's unfortunate. After centuries of religious bigotry, distrust and misunderstanding, we still haven't seemed to learn a thing.

First of all, part of what I wrote got deleted or edited out. It should have said, "...that appear occasionally on this site are okay, but not what a person believes. If people are uncomfortable with discussions about religion, they don't need to read these posts."

emmyaward4: many of us in the world believe that EVERYWHERE is the appropriate place for religion, at all times, in all circumstances. That is a lot different from shoving religion down people's throats. Sometimes -- not always, but sometimes -- people are uncomfortable about religion because they are insecure about their own beliefs. Whether or not this is the case with anyone in this forum, the fact remains that if you don't like what someone posts, you don't have to read it.

no
i am sorry but to post on regular basis & preach on an acting forum On a regular basis is not the thing to do.
I talk about religion All the time & i am secure in my beliefs & non beliefs, ( I have something to say so i MUST be insecure) what a crock
a line is being crossed with that & you know it.
again I can't stop him I do believe in freedom of speech
However, it's obvious people are getting annoyed that it is on a regular basis & every preachy
this is NOT the place, EVERYWHERE is not the place, always
i ]what about atheists? it's on our money it's everywhere as it is, sep of church & State remember?